tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11215059.post3531750129504683031..comments2023-12-19T20:25:36.069-06:00Comments on Nick's Twins Blog: Staying PutNick N.http://www.blogger.com/profile/00848574337121154690noreply@blogger.comBlogger41125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11215059.post-64878505488922636592011-08-03T12:26:59.151-05:002011-08-03T12:26:59.151-05:00since there isn't much to talk about how about...since there isn't much to talk about how about this starting pitching staff. hate to say it nick but tho i appreciate your optimism the liriano/blackburn haters going into the season seem to be right so far. what do you think the club should do this year and more importantly next year?go2012twinsnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11215059.post-87303767932739698652011-08-02T16:12:47.252-05:002011-08-02T16:12:47.252-05:00Got any ideas on RH relief help that might be avai...<i>Got any ideas on RH relief help that might be available through waiver wire deals? Preferably ones that will be around in 2012?</i><br /><br />Any chance Betancourt from the Rockies would pass through waivers? I'd love to land him. <br /><br />Seemed like the Rauch, Pavano and Fuentes additions all kind of came out of nowhere though so I suspect we'll be blindsided by whatever move Smith makes.Nick N.https://www.blogger.com/profile/00848574337121154690noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11215059.post-18164403164817183692011-08-02T15:39:50.029-05:002011-08-02T15:39:50.029-05:00I almost crapped my pants when Span was rumored to...I almost crapped my pants when Span was rumored to be a trade chip. With his production vs contract, why trade him? Keep Span around awhile if he's healthy enough to play and produce.<br /><br />I'm also not sure why everyone's so in love with Revere. An OBP south of .300 with ZERO power? He's not ready to lead off a big league lineup just yet. He and Nishi look overmatched (Revere much less so) but still deserve a shot somewhere in the organization for the near future.<br /> <br />I can see the beef with not trading Kubel or Cuddy. I can see wanting to keep one of them, but both? Makes no sense to me. Delmon's not going to bring you anything of value, so don't trade him now, either (unfortunately).<br /><br />I'd kill for another AJ trade for this organization, but will Billy-Bob at the wheel, good freakin luck.Matthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10984504525577892812noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11215059.post-90412417050273818512011-08-02T13:34:02.206-05:002011-08-02T13:34:02.206-05:00Good point.
Got any ideas on RH relief help that ...Good point.<br /><br />Got any ideas on RH relief help that might be available through waiver wire deals? Preferably ones that will be around in 2012?USAFChiefnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11215059.post-33338626993008940792011-08-02T13:31:43.205-05:002011-08-02T13:31:43.205-05:00"My claim is that on a play in which the catc..."My claim is that on a play in which the catcher bounces the throw to second on a steal attempt, with the SS covering and not even bothering to try to knock the ball down, it's inane to blame the second baseman for the ball going into center field. "<br /><br />That may have been your point, it wasn't the claim you made. In your enthusiasm for placing the whole blame on Casilla, you repeatedly insisted the second baseman wasn't even supposed to back the play up. No one ever even suggested he break with the pitch, which you keep repeating as if its some kind insider's knowledge of baseball you are privy to. The two are hardly exclusive.<br /><br />You can compare two plays on video. In both cases the second baseman didn't get to the ball. But in one case, Tolbert was at the edge of the outfield grass and the ball was just beyond his glove on a throw that was on the mark but the runner was already there. On the other play, Hughes can be seen standing there three feet in from the outfield grass and barely waving at the ball as it went by. <br /><br />You can also here the color guy mentioning Hughes wasn't in position. Which frankly, is where I came up with the idea. I wouldn't have recognized he was out of position. <br /><br />"thus leading me to believe that, yes, it's made up."<br /><br />Apparently there is a conspiracy out there to misinform people. More likely, some of us are old enough to remember. And just like me, they don't care enough to dig out old commentaries on a trade from 8 years ago.TThttp://grannybaseball.blogspot.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11215059.post-87461509616500804582011-08-02T12:36:50.053-05:002011-08-02T12:36:50.053-05:00I don't mind you mucking up the comments secti...I don't mind you mucking up the comments section, but it seems pointless to try and debate the minutia of baseball with a guy who doesn't even know what a contact play is.Nick N.https://www.blogger.com/profile/00848574337121154690noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11215059.post-31258287416008964732011-08-02T12:22:38.070-05:002011-08-02T12:22:38.070-05:00Nick...I apologize ahead of time for mucking up th...Nick...I apologize ahead of time for mucking up the comments section of your blog, but sometimes I'm just to stupid to stop mud wrestling with a pig...<br /><br /><br /><i>Chied - Quit trying to reinterpret the discussion. The question was whether Hughes was in position, not whether he should have been breaking on the pitch. And your claim was that the middle infielders don't back up one another on steals. You repeated that several times.</i><br /><br />Reinterpret the discussion? LOL. On a blog discussing the trade deadline, you're the one who steered the conversation to a play that happened in ?May?. <br /><br />My claim is that on a play in which the catcher bounces the throw to second on a steal attempt, with the SS covering and not even bothering to try to knock the ball down, it's inane to blame the second baseman for the ball going into center field. Which was the point of the original discussion. You claimed the second baseman was out of position and therefore the runner going to third was his fault. <br /><br />One last time: one a steal attempt, only one of the SS and/or second baseman is going to break to the bag to cover. The other middle infielder is going to hold his position, so that at least HALF the middle infield is still defended. After the ball passes the plate, if it's not put in play, the middle infielder who isn't covering the bag can, and often does, attempt to get to a position 25 ft or so directly behind second base so he can possibly back up up throw. But since it's generally physically impossible to GET to that position in time, most of the time bad throws go through to center field. That IS NOT the fault of the middle infielder who wasn't charged with covering second base. Ever. And it's beyond ridiculous to even consider blaming him for not being somewhere he can't possbily get to in the time available. <br /><br />Now can we drop this, and get back on subject?USAFChiefnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11215059.post-16558831660987813742011-08-02T11:27:05.521-05:002011-08-02T11:27:05.521-05:00So not only did you know I didn't "make i...<i>So not only did you know I didn't "make it up". Its an argument you have had with others as well.</i><br /><br />Yes, and those others -- just like you, and Scott Miller -- failed to produce any evidence to support their claim, thus leading me to believe that, yes, it's made up.<br /><br />Were there people who didn't like the trade? I'm sure there were, as there always are. But my recollection is not that it was "widely panned," and so far the only analysis I've been able to dig up was generally positive. You, still, have not provided a thing. <br /><br />Maybe that's how arguments work on your planet, though.Nick N.https://www.blogger.com/profile/00848574337121154690noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11215059.post-7161751904637604952011-08-02T05:44:00.111-05:002011-08-02T05:44:00.111-05:00"Well I certainly didn't read on Gleeman&..."Well I certainly didn't read on Gleeman's blog, because I prefer to read the original authors rather than creative re-writes. But here is the very next sentence in Gleeman's summary:"<br /><br />Exactly.<br /><br />Gleeman tries to play it both ways in almost every post he makes so he can come back and try to claim he is right later on.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11215059.post-77225702971912961112011-08-02T01:45:12.202-05:002011-08-02T01:45:12.202-05:00Fire Bill Smith! This guy needs to go. He has ma...Fire Bill Smith! This guy needs to go. He has made too many bad deals, and needs to be replaced by someone who is competent. Problem is: are the Twins willing to pay for someone who is competent.Twins2011noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11215059.post-40146793135918403722011-08-01T18:26:46.580-05:002011-08-01T18:26:46.580-05:00Twins are having an injury laden off year. But thi...Twins are having an injury laden off year. But this is the same team that has won the division repeatedly over the last 8 years. My diagnosis?<br /><br />We're battling hard with understudies everywhere. What we learned: Ben Revere can play. His arm is so so but he can hit and run and field. <br /><br />Ploufe deserves a shot. His bat is better n average for a middle infielder.<br /><br />Lexi is playing hard. Has had some really good games. <br /><br />Nishi... not quite ready. But maybe next year. Hard to criticize a guy who changed continents and is playing with a recently broken leg. <br /><br />Cuddy. He is family. Plays with guts and helps wherever he can. A Nick Punto who can hit. <br /><br />Mauer and Morneau. These guys just have to deliver. Battle back this year and retool for next.<br /><br />Valencia. Man what I'd give to have this kid's future.<br /><br />Delmon. Is still really Young. He needs to step up and be the player he wants to be.. <br /><br />Kubes. What would we have done without him in April and May?<br /><br />To those who say trade Cuddy. Never gonna happen. Uncle Mike is a Twin for life. Rumor has it he plans to play all 9 positions ala Tovar soon. <br /><br />Kubes? Naw. He is an odd kinda player, but nobody tries harder, and he can hit 25 HRs a year. When he gets hot he is Harmon light. <br /><br />Delmon? No way. His best days lie ahead.<br /><br />Span? He is solid in every aspect of the game. We will deal Revere before DS. <br /><br />Thome. Are you insane? He goes into the Hall wearing a Twins cap. He shoulda been a Twin years ago...<br /><br />Pitching? Deal Capps and Mijares and make a rule that nobody with a waistline over 34 pitches for the Twins.<br /><br />Blackburn has lost it temporarily, so slot Kevin in there for a month or so. <br /><br />Duenslinger is our most consistent starter. Nick, you don't put your most consistent starter in the pen to throw now and then.<br /><br />Give Perk a shot. He is pitching like a number 1 starter.<br /><br />Pavano got a few balls up last start. He'll be better. Liriano is an on and off guy. He needs to find out who he is. <br /><br />Burnett is not a major league pitcher. He gets shelled allatime.<br /><br />The pitching has to be there down the stretch or its a no go.<br /><br />For next year, the same team we have, if healthy, is a contender.<br /><br />Perk, Pav, Frankie, Baker, and Duesnslinger should be the rotation. Kev and Nick are long relief for now.Kelly Vancenoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11215059.post-77159338665206906882011-08-01T18:21:59.200-05:002011-08-01T18:21:59.200-05:00If saves are overated are blown saves overated too...If saves are overated are blown saves overated too? Because the Twins have more than Detroit and Cleveland combined. I'm sure it has nothing to do with being behind both ballclubs in the standings. <br /><br />Why wouldn't the Twins go out and get a lefty specialist rather than waste arguably their 2nd best starter? We're not talking about trying to land cliff lee here. They dont need left handed relief anymore or less than right handed relief because Burnett stinks it up more than phil dumatrait.Ken Baconnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11215059.post-45835221333281766292011-08-01T18:09:52.677-05:002011-08-01T18:09:52.677-05:00Yeah, because Average Game Score doesn't measu...Yeah, because Average Game Score doesn't measure the totality of circumstances. Neither does number of quality starts. Peripherals? Yeah, they don't matter either.<br /><br />You've got three starters on the staff less consistent than Duensing; one posting a higher WHIP and one an equivalent WHIP.<br /><br />Hasn't Duensing proven himself a reliable starter? Why dump him, when you have three other starters struggling, two of whom are likely not long-term members of the team (Pavano and Liriano)? <br /><br />Strikeout rate and swinging strike% don't measure a pitcher's effectiveness? Aren't those factors that a pitcher can control, while WHIP is contingent on a competent defense?mgravesnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11215059.post-59733738948597337202011-08-01T18:09:43.969-05:002011-08-01T18:09:43.969-05:00Chied - Quit trying to reinterpret the discussion....Chied - Quit trying to reinterpret the discussion. The question was whether Hughes was in position, not whether he should have been breaking on the pitch. And your claim was that the middle infielders don't back up one another on steals. You repeated that several times.<br /><br /><br />Nick -<br /><br />I think you are projecting. Below is a link to this same argument from the "battle your tail off" board, with you as one of the participants claiming Scott Miller, the former Twins beat writer, was wrong when he made this claim:<br /><br /><br />"The Twins generally were ripped in November, 2003, when they traded A.J. Pierzynski to San Francisco for a sore-armed middle reliever (current uber-closer Joe Nathan, a central figure in the Twins winning two AL Central titles in three seasons beginning in '04), a former first-round high school pick (current rotation member Boof Bonser) and a rookie league pitcher who had missed all of '02 with arm problems (Francisco Liriano, who was sensational in 2006 for the Twins with 12 wins and a 2.16 ERA and will be back this year after missing 2007 following elbow surgery)."<br /><br />http://www.battleyourtailoff.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=12221&start=0<br /><br />So not only did you know I didn't "make it up". Its an argument you have had with others as well. You even used Gleeman's blog to support your argument.TThttp://grannybaseball.blogspot.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11215059.post-29057998327351161222011-08-01T17:46:31.768-05:002011-08-01T17:46:31.768-05:00"Kind of the way you don't remember seein..."Kind of the way you don't remember seeing middle infielders back up second on steals?" ... No, kind of like I don't remember seeing both middle infielders leave their position every time someone takes off from first. What I do recall seeing is bad throws from the catcher get fielded by the center fielder on every team I've ever watched, at every level from little league to the majors, so I guess I'm not the only one who doesn't think it's reasonable to expect a 2nd baseman to be able to back up bad throws routinely on steals. Perhaps that's because no team, at any level, has both middle infielders moving when a runner takes off. Maybe baseball is played differently on your planet...the planet where the Twins had a great offseason plan.<br /><br />But then again I shouldn't be surprised to see you attempt to change the subject rather than respond to the request for quotes to back up your claims. Changing the argument is one of your standard tactics, whenever you're caught in a fabrication or error.USAFChiefnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11215059.post-53577356030968266522011-08-01T17:08:44.450-05:002011-08-01T17:08:44.450-05:00"Cause that's not how I remember it."..."Cause that's not how I remember it." <br /><br />Kind of the way you don't remember seeing middle infielders back up second on steals? <br /><br />Nick -<br /><br />Well I certainly didn't read on Gleeman's blog, because I prefer to read the original authors rather than creative re-writes. But here is the very next sentence in Gleeman's summary:<br /><br />"Of course, there is a big difference between not being a "bad" trade and being a "good" one. I think whether or not this deal ends up being a good one hinges on either Bonser or Liriano becoming a solid major league pitcher."<br /><br />Not exactly a ringing endorsement of Nathan. But there were plenty of other people saying Sabean had taken Ryan to the cleaners.TThttp://grannybaseball.blogspot.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11215059.post-46473098569159356772011-08-01T15:24:53.209-05:002011-08-01T15:24:53.209-05:00Maybe by internet wise guy TT meant the author of ...Maybe by internet wise guy TT meant the author of the Granny Baseball blog, who told us in May that the "Twins offseason looks smart in retrospect."USAFChiefnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11215059.post-26197547246137243382011-08-01T15:02:24.853-05:002011-08-01T15:02:24.853-05:00No GM or BB exec is going to be right all the time...No GM or BB exec is going to be right all the time, but I think the problem is that it seems like ever since the 2006 season this franchise has been straying farther from the bullseye when it comes to making deals. For example, Fuentes was a nice pickup last year, but then wasn't retained. Same with Hardy. It's hard to see a coherent long term strategy right now for getting better. Seems like too much treading water. Maybe Morneau will come back in August and start showing his old form. That would be a nice way to end the season.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11215059.post-69276326271280131072011-08-01T14:36:58.379-05:002011-08-01T14:36:58.379-05:00Can you find us some quotes? Cause that's not ...<i>Can you find us some quotes? Cause that's not how I remember it.</i><br /><br />Yeah, I think this is just another example of our pal TT making up facts to support his imaginary narrative. I found only one blog with archives dating back to November '03, and that's Gleeman's. Here was his <a href="http://www.aarongleeman.com/2003_11_16_baseballblog_archive.html" rel="nofollow">summary of the deal</a>:<br /><br />"Ultimately, I don't think there is really any way for the Pierzynski-trade to be viewed as a bad one. At worst, they lost one good year from Pierzynski, who was almost certainly a goner after next year anyway. I would be willing to bet just about anything that Joe Mauer will not be better than Pierzynski offensively next year, but I still think Mauer will be a productive major league catcher. And in exchange for that drop-off, the Twins got three valuable pitchers and saved a couple million bucks."<br /><br />Stupid internet wise guy.Nick N.https://www.blogger.com/profile/00848574337121154690noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11215059.post-1376871484048186452011-08-01T13:35:33.970-05:002011-08-01T13:35:33.970-05:00BTW - the trade of A.J. Prezynski to San Francisco...<i>BTW - the trade of A.J. Prezynski to San Francisco was widely panned by the wise guys on the internet.</i><br /><br />Can you find us some quotes? Cause that's not how I remember it.USAFChiefnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11215059.post-50677870229712749762011-08-01T13:22:17.093-05:002011-08-01T13:22:17.093-05:00BTW - the trade of A.J. Prezynski to San Francisco...BTW - the trade of A.J. Prezynski to San Francisco was widely panned by the wise guys on the internet. They traded an allster catcher for a failed prospect (Bonser), a sore-armed reliever (Nathan) who only one season back from missing a season on the DL and a low-level prospect (Liriano) with a history of arm trouble. <br /><br />The only time GM's aren't idiots is for about a week after their team wins the World Series. That honeymoon usually ends with the first roster move for the next season.TThttp://grannybaseball.blogspot.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11215059.post-84225615614856147132011-08-01T13:06:02.238-05:002011-08-01T13:06:02.238-05:00"hey made the ill-fated Capps trade"
Ye..."hey made the ill-fated Capps trade"<br /><br />Yep, sure was ill-fated. They made the playoffs last year, remember? And the guy they gave up has been struggling since April. <br /><br />Ramos was a good prospect, he may well end up having a better career than Capps. But the last couple months his bat wouldn't have contributed much more than any of the other Twins backup catchers. And I suspect his defense is not as good as Butera's either. <br /><br />What Capp's struggles really demonstrate is that when you regularly start warming up your closer in the 8th inning, you are asking for trouble. <br /><br />Its not going to help the bullpen to move a successful starter who has gone into the 7th inning in all but one start this month into the bullpen. If you are going to put Slowey in the rotation, Blackburn is the guy to send to the bullpen.TThttp://grannybaseball.blogspot.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11215059.post-57979122508896479082011-08-01T12:43:10.656-05:002011-08-01T12:43:10.656-05:00The Twins are still in contention and they need re...<i>The Twins are still in contention and they need relief pitching. But they are likely going to have first crack at every reliever who is put on waivers. And, as the only bidder, they won't have to give up an arm and a leg for someone.</i><br /><br />Ah, so that's Bill's plan. Gut the middle infield and the bullpen in the offseason to make sure we're first in line on August waiver claims for the scum that other teams don't want. Brilliant!USAFChiefnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11215059.post-30487787959635333302011-08-01T12:19:25.481-05:002011-08-01T12:19:25.481-05:00"Can't they do that during the offseason?..."Can't they do that during the offseason?"<br /><br />Well sure but I don't think they'll get much in return for Cuddy, Thome, Kubel, Capps, Nathan, etc in the offseason. Unless we should keep going on and on with these guys until they retire? <br /><br />I realize not everyone was going to get traded. Still, though, I just don't understand what doing absolutely nothing tells us about the direction of this franchise. "We're content with where we are - complete mediocrity"? It's either this or the Twins Hubris coming out again: "Sure, we're 6 games out, and sure, the 2 teams we're chasing got better at the deadline. But we're the Twins. We always find a Way. The Twins Way."Ed Bastnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11215059.post-34048780451779728352011-08-01T11:09:42.970-05:002011-08-01T11:09:42.970-05:00Even with his struggles against RH hitters, he fac...<i>Even with his struggles against RH hitters, he faces teams, not individuals and it is the totality of circumstances which indicate effectiveness.</i><br /><br />Right. So, looking past the hand-picked stats that overstate his effectiveness, let's look at the overall numbers: 4.35 ERA, 1.42 WHIP, 3.91 xFIP. Those aren't bad numbers, but there's no reason to think Slowey can't match them, and Duensing drastically improves the bullpen.<br /><br /><i>That's fans are conditioned to value "nice guys" above serious contention. Sure, we passed up an opportunity to add talent to the organization and really gear up for a 2012 run.</i><br /><br />Can't they do that during the offseason?<br /><br /><i>Does anyone think Jon Rauch had the best stuff in the bullpen last year? They made him the closer because they thought he could handle the job, not just because he had a few saves. </i><br /><br />Actually I'm pretty sure it's "because he had a few saves" -- he'd been a closer with (who else?) the Nationals back in '08 -- that they thought Rauch could handle the job. And ultimately they didn't think he could handle it, because they made the ill-fated Capps trade at a point when Rauch's overall numbers were still quite good.<br /><br />All the Twins could talk about when they acquired Capps was how good his "makeup" was. We've seen how that's worked out.Nick N.https://www.blogger.com/profile/00848574337121154690noreply@blogger.com